"some music was meant to stay underground..."

Stage Diver At Clutch Show Could Face Up To 8 Years In Prison

The Associated Press is reporting that a man charged with injuring two women when he dived off the stage at a heavy metal concert said he never realized someone in the crowd could be hurt.

Joseph Seink wept Monday (Feb. 7) while testifying in his trial on two counts of felonious assault. Authorities say two 28-year-old Cleveland women each suffered a cracked neck vertebra but no serious spinal damage when the 195-pound Seink landed on them last June 4 at Scene Pavilion downtown.

Seink, 34, of suburban Solon, said he sneaked backstage to see his favorite band, CLUTCH, and celebrated by jumping into the crowd when his favorite song began.

"The last thing I wanted was to hurt anybody," Seink testified during his one-day trial in Cuyahoga County Common Pleas Court.

He could be sentenced to two to eight years in prison if convicted of both charges, said Jamie Dalton, a spokeswoman for the county prosecutor's office.

Judge Nancy Fuerst is expected to rule Wednesday.

"He should have known he was going to hurt somebody," said Brian Deckert, an assistant county prosecutor.

Catherine Tressa and Tammie Myers both said they didn't expect someone would jump off the stage over security guards during the concert.

Witnesses told Seink's public defender, Walter Camino, that heavy metal shows are characterized by violent slam dancing. Occasionally, witnesses said, audience members dive off the stage, expecting the crowd to catch them.

Source: Blabbermouth

What's Next?

Please share this article if you found it interesting.

You can get related band news and info in the sidebar and on the respective band pages.


21 Comments on "Stage Diver Could Face Up To 8 Years In Prison"

Post your comments and discuss the article below! (no login required)

Anonymous Reader
1. corruptsociety writes:

that's f*cked up! Of course you expect hell to be raised at a concert! That's what metal's about goddamit!!!!

# Feb 9, 2005 @ 1:05 AM ET | IP Logged Reveal posts originating from the same IP address
Anonymous Reader
2. STP93 writes:

I agree...what were those b****es expecting, a f***in ballet atmosphere? They shouldn't have been that close to begin with, they're f***in chicks!

# Feb 9, 2005 @ 2:57 AM ET | IP Logged Reveal posts originating from the same IP address
Anonymous Reader
3. BIGSTICK13 writes:

You know people are going to use this as an example of violents in music. People should be blaming themselves and their own stupidity about stuff like this, i mean really, what did those two b****es think happens at a concert. So f*cking stupid!!

# Feb 9, 2005 @ 11:16 AM ET | IP Logged Reveal posts originating from the same IP address
Anonymous Reader
4. Dejackemo writes:

Put your arms up, dumb sluts! I can see it if the dude was 300 pounds. Dont stage dive if you are a whale but come on, put your arms up for the guy. Dont let your stupidity snap your stupid neck.

# Feb 9, 2005 @ 3:41 PM ET | IP Logged Reveal posts originating from the same IP address
Anonymous Reader
5. LOK HIMMM writes:

if they wre that f***ing close to the stage, they had to expect a certain amount of damage. they are probably looking for someone to sue. greedy bi*ches. they probably are'nt even that hurt. HIMMM!!!!

# Feb 9, 2005 @ 4:07 PM ET | IP Logged Reveal posts originating from the same IP address
deathbringer's avatar

Founder, owner & programmer

6. deathbringer writes:

I tend to disagree with the sentiment here. Regardless of whether or not the girls expected someone to stage dive (they have to say they didn't expect it or it would hurt their case), it doesn't give people the right to do thoughtless things like the stage diver. No more should those girls have to endure that than someone getting punched in the face by some hardcore dancer. Or what if the highly publicized attacks at hardcore shows became "common". Would you then berate the person who sued over being jumped by 5 guys and beaten near-death because he should "expect that" at a hardcore show? I feel the blame in this case should be shared, but falls more on the stage diver's shoulders. Just like the girls should have "known better" that there may be stage divers, the diver has some responsibility to be a little careful (in his recklessness) and/or expect that someone might get hurt and come after them in whatever way they may. Certainly stage divers take a moment to make sure they aren't jumping into an empty hole, so maybe they should take a second longer and make sure the people there can actually support them.

A 200lb guy jumping on you is no small force either. I can understand how these 130-150 lb skinny guys get away with it all the time, but 200lbs is quite a big difference. What if it WERE a 300lb guy? 500? Where do you draw the line. Why is the line drawn in pounds? These girls had their necks broken! Perhaps 8 years is a little harsh, but it should be a wakeup call to everyone who is so shocked and disagrees. Carelessness can cost you a lot more than you would expect or think it should, so try to be somewhat responsible for your actions and everyone will get more enjoyment out of the shows. OK, I'll stop lecturing now ;-)

# Feb 9, 2005 @ 4:36 PM ET | IP Logged Reveal posts originating from the same IP address
Anonymous Reader
7. LOK HIMMM writes:

good point and good perspective, deathbringer, the thing i found curiuos was that they both suffered the exact same injury. coincidence, maybe....maybe not. you are right on your point that he should have been a little more aware of his surroundings.

# Feb 9, 2005 @ 4:42 PM ET | IP Logged Reveal posts originating from the same IP address
Anonymous Reader
8. corruptsociety writes:

I don't disagree with you deathbringer, but all I must say is that 8 years IS very harsh. In fact, I think jailtime alone is pretty harsh for this guy. Here's why: At a metal concert, you definetly aren't expecting your neck to be literally broken. But when you go to one, you need to expect that there is a lot of energy, and a lot of aggression being let out, and when you're letting out this energy and aggression, you aren't thinking about it. So, in a way nearly everyone is being thoughtless and just having fun. You need to be prepared for the mosh pits, and for people who will smother you in sweat and seemingly try to crush you trying to get closer to the stage. I admit 200lbs is a lot, but like you said, he's in a state of thoughtlessness, letting out some aggression, and just having fun. He DID NOT EXPECT to hurt those girls, and that's why I don't think he deserves jailtime. I don't think it's his fault. People stagedive all the time. Who wouldn't want the experience of trying that? Hell, i've done it! It's fun as hell! And if anything, it would be hard to miss a 200lb guy jumping at you. The point is that he didn't know he hurt those girls, probably something he feels horrible for doing, and that's why this possible harsh sentencing is wrong. It was an accident. Plain and simple.

# Feb 9, 2005 @ 4:58 PM ET | IP Logged Reveal posts originating from the same IP address
Anonymous Reader
9. BLACK DOG writes:

BUMMER!!!!!!!

# Feb 9, 2005 @ 5:21 PM ET | IP Logged Reveal posts originating from the same IP address
Rue's avatar

Member

10. Rue writes:

I think you all have good points. I like what Deathbringer said, and I like what corruptsociety said about the thoughtlessness with which you release your agression at a metal show. It makes pretty good sense to me. He was in a completely different state of mind, just like I am at the metal shows I go to. I just say f*** it, I'm goin nuts..and all else flies out the window..its that adrenaline rush..Now the judge only needs to understand that. And no need at all to sentence this man to prison, or fine him any money, it would be really unfair to him, because it was carelessness on everybody's part. Heh, I'm glad Im a skinny dude, so I can stage dive and I wont hurt people.

# Feb 9, 2005 @ 6:33 PM ET | IP Logged Reveal posts originating from the same IP address
Anonymous Reader
11. The Ambassador writes:

That is a load of crap.Stage diving has been going on for many years.I am sick of these wimpy people going up front of the stage and expecting things not to happen to them.If you are that stupid{specially a clutch concert}and not expecting anything from stage diving to surfing the crowd-then your butt is totally brain dead.You pretty soon it is going to be that when we go to concerts anymore,we are going to have to act like robots and just stand there and clap hands and do nothing cause these people are trying to stop people like me and other of having fun.You get hurt-deal with it.I have had over 100 injuries in my life from pits and I have never wanted to charge anyone anything,it is part of the show.And again,If you don't wan to get hurt,then step in the back row and leave us people who like to have fun alone and shut up.

# Feb 10, 2005 @ 12:41 AM ET | IP Logged Reveal posts originating from the same IP address
Anonymous Reader
12. Straight Punk writes:

200 pounds when supported by even 6 people brings the weight ratio to about 33 pounds per person...so I wouldn't consider that heavy. I feel bad for those injured but the incident was not intentional and the man should not have to go through this.

# Feb 10, 2005 @ 10:05 AM ET | IP Logged Reveal posts originating from the same IP address
Anonymous Reader
13. LOK HIMMM writes:

does anyone else share my opinion that these girls are trying to grasp an oppurtunity to get paid? how can they both have the same injury? did they go to the same doctor? are thier injuries actually as severe as they claim? is the media jacking up the claim to give further credence to thier latest " metal is dangerous" campaign? lot of questions still to be answered in my mind. and what's with this hard-ass judge? is it an election year? is an example trying to be made? OR IS IT JUST ME WHO IS ASKING THESE QUESTIONS. HIMMM!!!!

# Feb 10, 2005 @ 10:12 AM ET | IP Logged Reveal posts originating from the same IP address
Anonymous Reader
14. Gary writes:

that is so messed up that is what happens at metal concerts people stage dive. so this should not be a court case it is the dumb b****es fault for not looking whats going on around them

# Feb 10, 2005 @ 11:55 AM ET | IP Logged Reveal posts originating from the same IP address
Anonymous Reader
15. Slaughter Of The Soul writes:

I do agree with what Deathbringer said. However, as a counterpoint, people get hurt at shows (all different types of music) all the time. Even if they are not in an enviroment where people are moshing , stagediving or being pit ninjas. I'm sure everyone that frequents music events has at one time or another been hurt. I can remember how many times I've been standing up front trying to get a good glimpse of a band and then gotten trapped between the crowd and the barrier. Or just trying to get around, tripping over someone and not being able to get up.

The fact of the matter is, it's a small, crowded area where everyone is trying to be as close to the state as possible. Add to that the nature of metal/rock shows and someone is bound to get hurt. There has been a precedence set for such behavior at shows. I've even seen security assisting stage divers. I don't think the girls have a solid case. Anyone that 's into rock music knows what they are getting into when they go to a show .

# Feb 10, 2005 @ 1:18 PM ET | IP Logged Reveal posts originating from the same IP address
Anonymous Reader
16. brokenwings13 writes:

Deathbringer has a point. But I have to say, why not just have the guy pay those girls medical bills instead of serving time!!

# Feb 10, 2005 @ 7:11 PM ET | IP Logged Reveal posts originating from the same IP address
darkstar's avatar

Senior News Correspondent

17. darkstar writes:

brokenwings13 has a point. Paying their medical bills would be more fair than having to serve that much time for something unintentional.

corruptsociety: yeah, it may be hard for someone to miss a 200lb guy jumping at you. But there really isn't much time for you to react. And if you're in the mosh pit, there's nowhere to go. So you're kinda like stuck there.

# Feb 10, 2005 @ 7:17 PM ET | IP Logged Reveal posts originating from the same IP address
Anonymous Reader
18. Catherine writes:

Wow, I'm amazed about the civilized argument you all are having. It's much better than the whining and complaining that I read on all these posts. In respect to the two women and their situation, brokenwings, you were right to say that their medical bills should be partially compensated. You take a degree of risk at a concert, but you don't go expecting to break your neck, but there's still a huge risk. Especially toward the front! In a freak accident, where no one suffered life-threatening injuries, (although these two ladies could have been killed very easily--the neck is very fragile), no one should serve jailtime. The courts should read this page before a verdict is made...

# Feb 10, 2005 @ 7:39 PM ET | IP Logged Reveal posts originating from the same IP address
Anonymous Reader
19. brokenwings13 writes:

Thanks guys. Catherine, we're never this civil, it's scary the kind of discussion we're having right now, it's away from the norm.

Now the article said the judge was supposeed to rule on Wednesday, the article was published on Tuesday, so what was the decision? Does anyone know?

# Feb 10, 2005 @ 8:37 PM ET | IP Logged Reveal posts originating from the same IP address
deathbringer's avatar

Founder, owner & programmer

20. deathbringer writes:

Thanks for pointing out the date of the decision - I am posting an update to it now.

Regarding some of the other arguments here:

Paying the medical bills should definitely be in whatever settlement is made. But the bottom line is that this is a criminal trial, not a civil trial. Those ladies still have every right to sue for damages. I understand everyone's feeling about letting loose and having fun at a show, but that does not make you any less responsible for your actions and their consequences (neither does the alcohol if you're drinking). Should it be ok to loot during a riot? Ok to drive drunk because others do it? If someone had been killed, it would have been manslaughter, so the charges were in line with the injury and "crime", IMO. (The guy got off pretty easy in the end)

Regarding Straight Punk's estimates on the foce of a 200lb stage diver...they are perfect for a CROWD SURFER, not a stage diver. My physics are too rusty to do a real calculation, but a ballpark estimate is that the real force could be 5-10 times his body weight, depending on how high he jumped and how much outward force (distance) he had.

Finally in my other post I made a statement about "expect that someone might get hurt and come after them in whatever way they may". I generally have a "no harm, no foul" attitude at concerts even if I don't like some of the "antics" going on around me. But barring my neck being broken, if some stage diver kicked me in the face or really hurt me, I'd pull his a$$ down and pound him back for it. These girls had their necks broken, so criminal charges or a suit is really their only recourse.

# Feb 10, 2005 @ 11:05 PM ET | IP Logged Reveal posts originating from the same IP address
Anonymous Reader
21. brokenwings13 writes:

I saw the trial post. There probably will be a civil suit, unless those girls are satisfied with the decision made by the judge.

# Feb 10, 2005 @ 11:33 PM ET | IP Logged Reveal posts originating from the same IP address

To minimize comment spam/abuse, you cannot post comments on articles over a month old. Please check the sidebar to the right or the related band pages for recent related news articles.